Little puzzled

[HERPSKEEPER]

A while back i was out 4-wheeling the florence area, off the kelvin hwy, when i saw a lizard run out in front of us. I didnt get a good look at it, but i can tell you this. It was tan in color and about 2-3ft in lenght. We got out and tryed to catch it but i was to fast for us. I think it was a desert iguana(sp), but if you know what it might be let me. Thanks P.S. For those that know the area, It was in the big boulder pile

[brandi]

Just for the record, i have found desert iggys in that area south and east of Florence junction. One in rocks and one in flat scrub.

[Neurotoxin]

I have seen both desert Iguana's and Leopard lizards in that area.
The male Leopards are a nice tan color with spots.

[brandi]

just for the record, is Kelvin off 79... the one after cottonwood canyon? or is that the one that goes back to the coke ovens?

[HERPSKEEPER]

Kelvin goes from florence out to kerney(sp)

[Neurotoxin]

It's the one that runs right by the prison in town (Florence) to the town of
Riverside. There is a few ways to get to the coke ovens. The best IMO is
cochran rd. Cottonwood canyon rd. is closer to Florence junction. But will
also get you to the coke ovens. Price rd. to box canyon rd. would be easier
to get to the ovens and is a nice drive.

btw If the Gila river is running high you won't want to go cochran rd. You have to cross the river to get to the coke ovens. Or walk down the rail road
tracks to the bridge at Price to cross the river.

[brandi]

I think i know the area you are reffering to. I actually used to work out on the Guard's artillery range. when I saw the iggys, one was on "the pipeline" road and the other was off cottonwood canyon road. I've only been to the coke ovens once (I don't have a jeep :( ) and the gila was little more than a couple puddles when we went. I've also seen leopards in the area, but they don't get that big!

[Neurotoxin]

Yes I have been all over that area years ago. I don't have and have never had
a jeep. If you ever get a chance take price rd. to box canyon it is a nice
drive. And a awesome place to take pictures. The old bridge with the tunnel
and the coke ovens are great. Your right about the Leopards only get around
16". Sometimes lizards look bigger from a distance and running. LOL But
desert Iguana's only get a inch or two longer. Who knows without a pic. Some
of the biggest atrox I have ever seen were in that area also.

[Gila Kid]

That's one of my favorite areas. I was just there on Tuesday hunting. The river is real low right now. That box canyon road is a good day trip. I've seen desert torts right in that steep sided canyon. I also concur about the big WDB's down there. The biggest I ever saw was in the big Donnelley Wash, just south of the river. The area you're talking about is called the Boulders. It used to be real nice right there, and some big mulies hung out in there. But now there's just a bunch of trash and spray painted boulders. And to top it all of they just fenced in a huge portion for custom homes. Inspite of all this it's still my favorite herpin' and huntin' spot. Probably cause it's only a few minutes from my house!

[brandi]

Did you check out the desert tort you found out there? If you notice, the desi on my avatar has a telemetry transmitter on her. she's part of a study run by AZGFD, only a few miles from the area you are talking about. And I was out there hunting too! used to be a good spot for quail, but not so much this season. also used to find lots of scutes out there... mostly in the washes. careful in the coke ovens, i found a complete crotalus shed in the rafters of one of them ... it measured about 3' long.

[Gila Kid]

It didn't have one, but I'm not sure one would fit on the plastron of a little 3" tort. He was so cute. I wanted to take him so bad, but I didn't even want to aproach to closely with my camera. I was afraid he would void his bladder and it was hot, and he was a long way from the river. I wish they weren't in so much trouble. We always had them in the yard when I was little(not sure if that was before or after they went on the list). have you seen many quail this year. Only 3 in my bag in 3 days of hunting. Hopefully that will change as I just recieved a German Short Hair Pointer pup and am begginning the long process of training.

[Neurotoxin]

There was a unofficial record 6'10" atrox that came out of the spine years ago.
The spine is east of Kelvin on the north side of the gila river. I found my Patternless mojave on my way home from that area in sept.1, 2001.
Great day!

[JJFeldner]

That big. In that area, you can expect Leopard Lizards or Desert Iguanas but if the thing you saw was actually as big as you say, It was probably an exotic, although what it may be from your description, I do not know.

[brandi]

we wouldn't tag a 3" tort, although there are very small transmitters for juvies. but we do notch the carapace to create an ID number. but good call not to bother the little guy... its so hard staying alive when you are that small! If you really want a tortoise check out Adobe wildlife reffuge. they always have a bunch of rescue/confiscated tortoises that need good homes. I'm hoping to adopt 2 when the new house gets built :D

[Gila Kid]

The WDB I saw was at the very least 6' 6". How do I know? Because when I saw it I was only 14 or so and back then I killed every rattler I saw. I took it's hide back and without the head and before stretching it was over 6'. Now before I start getting hate mail this was a long time ago when the only good rattler was a dead one to my group of cohorts. Of course I quit doing this a long time ago, but I still have all of my skins(mojave, arizona black, wdb, blacktail, tiger, great basin, sidewinder, etc.). Some of these are roadkills that weren't too smashed. My dad always said if I wanted to harvest them I'd have to eat them, which I always did right over the campfire(tastes like flakey chicken). I know this is going to piss some of you off, but try to remember this was a long time ago and attitudes have changed, including mine. This is in large part due to organizations like this one and their education programs. So props to you AHA.

[Gila Kid]

I have a pool and from what I've heard you can't have a pool in your yard if you want to adopt one. I'm not sure why, we have 3 russians and 3 culcattas at my dad's house and he has a pool. They never care to get that close to the big blue thing surrounded by cool deck. hey Brandi, did you get my pm.

[brandi]

nope didn't get it... you can try again or email me <angelstripes11@hotmail.com> Or AIM or MSN messenger.

[brandi]

ah yes, pools are bad. but i'm pretty sure if you fence them off properly its ok. Don't feel bad about eating rattlesnake, I figure its like any other wild game. You should be responsible, ethincal, and humane in you manner of take, and you must use anything you harvest. Rattlesnakes are beautiful, amazing creatures, and i don't eat them any more because it breaks my heart to kill one. But they are not endangered or threatened. I guess its just recognizing the difference between hunting for food and hunting just to kill stuff (which i hate!).

[Donna]

Desert torts can be obtained out side of the Adobe program however I'd still be wary of the pool situation. The requirements are there to protect the animals so even if you don't adopt though them, it's good to follow their guidelines.

When I first started wanting desert tortoises some people would ask me why I would want a valueless animal. I am totally fasinated by my torts. I still prefer my deserts over my leopards. :)

Donna

[brandi]

they really do have personality! I was tracking probably 30 torts at one time (radio telemetry study for G&F) and each one was a character all his/her own. Cant wait until the house is built so i can adopt mine...

am going to have to install special doggie fences though... Dogs and torts don't mix. even if they appear friendly. just had another baby brought in that was chewed. "the dog never bothered it before!" poor little thing... he's in good hands now but what a mess! sorry, off topic ramble. negligent people just make me angry!

[Donna]

You are so right about dogs and tortoises not mixing! We tried putting our dogs into a run, they only went to extreme measures to get out. So, for now the Tortoises are in the dog runs when they are not in their indoor home. LOL

Donna

[brandi]

yep. my mom breeds german shepherds (they're gorgeous, for mammals) so we're going to use pool fence to fence off part of the side yard, and then do cinderblock on the inside of that up to about 3' high. this will keep the dogs out and the torts far enough from the fence so they don't get grabbed.